King hard spot after service...

Discussion in 'Observed Trials Discussion' started by oicdn, Aug 21, 2004.

  1. oicdn

    oicdn Guest

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    Got my bike back yesterday. Didn't get a chance to even ride it cause of the rain. But this morning when pulling it out of the car, I pedaled around for a second, and when I went to pedal backwards while moving foreward, I went to go pedal foreward again, and it was about 1/4 pedal stroke before it engaged.....I was like WTF????

    Well, it wasn't engagement, it was that it was STICKING. It rolls fine, and engages fine, but say I try to switch my footing, there's a spot where it will stop spinning backwards, and the chain will just loosen, and if I keep back pedaling, obviously, it comes off the front chain ring cause the freehub body isn't spinning backwards....

    Am I just supposed to ride and let the lube just "break-in"? In all other purposes it works fine, but there's that hard turning spot. You can't even notice it pedaling (atleast I can't)...normal?
     
  2. thetart20

    thetart20 TartyBikes

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    Hmm... certainly not normal.

    Pull the axle and driveshell out and inspect the needle bearings inside the driveshell - sounds like one of them may be split/cracked. Also stick your finger in there and test how sticky/thick the grease is - if its too thick, it will make the drive mechanism bind/drag a little. Check for correct bearing preload when re-assembling - that could also be an issue.

    If thats fine, pick the back wheel, pedal it up to speed and gently hold the pedals... if it doesnt freewheel, or tend to 'jump' about a bit (in that i mean it freewheels, then catches, trying to push the pedals round, then freewheels again), take it back to the shop where you had it serviced and have them sort it.

    Any other questions, post back and i'll see what else i can muster :)

    Cheers,
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  3. oicdn

    oicdn Guest

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    It coast's/rolls fine. If you pick up the rear and just spin the wheel, there's no detectible sticking spots. Only when you try to pedal it backwards while the wheel is rolling does it stick.

    Like if you had your bike on a stand, and you just tried to crank the cranks backwards, it should spin freely right? Well if I tried that, it would stick at ONE spot and not rotate back FREELY. I can rotate it back with my finger, but it sticks enough to where if I wanted to backpedal, it would slack the chain, and if I pedal anymore, the chain would come off cause the freehub body stuck......but it ROLLS FINE, no detectible sticks when rolling. Only when I try to back pedal...
     
  4. oicdn

    oicdn Guest

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    Well, seems after I put it back together(what little I took it apart), it still had a little hardspot, not as bad as before though, but it was still enough to make it where I couldn't pedal it backwards without it getting stuck (but wheel was still turning, fine). So I put it on the stand, and pedaled it by hand and did notice the spots were noticeable if pedaled by hand. So I pedaled it in a high gear and did small back pedals until I got a full rotation. It kept sticking in one spot, but would roll through it once I sped up the pace. Eventually, it went away...:wtf:

    Could the grease not have been COMPLETLY covering everything? It appeared it was when it was apart. Or maybe the grease needed to be warmed up? I'm not gonna ride it for awhile and see if that was the issue....but as of now, it's gone.....:wtf:
     
  5. xxxfr

    xxxfr RCP FABRICATION

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    who rebuilt it, sounds like too much of a too thick lube was used, 4 or 5 drops of tri flow does it well for me
     
  6. oicdn

    oicdn Guest

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    Well, gave it an hour and some, then went to go ride it, and first thing it did was not freewheel when I backpedaled (got stuck), and the chain hopped off. So I think I'm gonna head out to the LBS to get it cleaned/lubed.....cause this sucks. Any little back pedal movement and it sticks, so I can't even pedal kick or get on the rear without the chain getting all faggy on me.....

    Any suggestions on what lube to use?
     
  7. tomacropod

    tomacropod Rum Pig

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    this happens for a little while after it's been rebuilt with ringdrive grease. Dilute it with a little bit of triflow, or increase the B-tension screw on your derailleur (or equivalent), or just wait for it to break in. Do a lot of coasting. Or do all of the above. This is assuming that the right sort of grease was used and that there is no foreign matter in there. If it wasn't, or there is, amend and goto top.

    - Joel
     
  8. xxxfr

    xxxfr RCP FABRICATION

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    ive always used tri flow, ive heard finish line is good too....
     
  9. B1105

    B1105 New Member

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    Tri Flow works fine, you dont need King lube, but if you wanna spend more money and feel special, get the King stuff.
     
  10. oicdn

    oicdn Guest

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    Yeah, the guy who deals with the king Hubs wasn't there today......so I have to wait till tomorrow. I sat there watching TV with the rear propped up, and I'de pedal it, and just let it coast for about 45 minutes....and I also held the bottom pulley on my derailleur and forced the freebody to rotate backwards for about 15 minutes and the hardspot is still there. LOL, 45 minutes of coasting has to be quite a distance. The sticky spot still hasn't lessened either. Gonna bring it back to the shop in the morning. So I just tell the guy to put in a couple drops of Triflow?

    It's really iritating me. I tried to do just static hops around the place, and getting on my rear to atleast just do hops, and the little bit it has to rotate backwards, it sticks, and screws me all up as I can't even get my footing......complete shit....
     
  11. tomacropod

    tomacropod Rum Pig

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    put it in yourself. Just get two 5mm allen keys, undo the axle caps, unscrew the two retaining pieces from the non-drive side, and pull out the axle/driveshell assembly from the right. Put some triflow on the splines on the driveshell, and then drop some in between the drive and driven rings on the inside of the hub shell, you'll have to put your finger in the other side of the hubshell to pull the rings away from each other. There is nothing, like bearings or small parts, that can fall out. After you've triflowed it, just put the driveshell back in and rotate it in the drive direction to seat it properly. You should hear a "pop" when it goes into place. Now tighten the axle/bearing/preload/whatever cap (with the 4 indentations in it) onto the other end of the axle, with a 5mm in the driveside axle end, just as tight as your finger can make it. This shouldn't be tight at all, don't use any tool to tighten that up. Then you just screw on the last retaining cap (with the 5mm in it) and torque the two allen keys together. You should exert yourself a bit doing this.

    These are instructions for classic, ISO or discgotech hubs with the standard axle. Don't tell me I've wasted my time and you've got an HD axle.

    for the love of god, don't take it to some guy, I love working on my kings, if you have any appreciation for fine-ass engineering and manufacturing, look inside, you'll love it.

    - Joel
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2004
  12. oicdn

    oicdn Guest

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    I love taking shit apart and appreciating engineering, but I have no triflow either. And if I take it back to the shop...it's free, or atleast it better be...

    And as of right now, the noise is loud where it sticks, like comparable to when you are sanding something by hand, that "shhh" sound. It does it on the stocking spots. It didn't do that before, but the sticking spot WAS worse off. For the past 3 hours, I've just been sitting here and pedaling it fast and just letting the wheel coast, then cranking it again. My tension spring is fully cranked. and out of curiousity to see how BAD it sticks, I held the bottom pulley and pedaled it backwards, and I don't think and spring tension will help it roll through as I have to hold it pretty well, atleast until I get it up to speed then I don't have to hold it as hard.

    Hopefully I'm not fucking anything by just letting it coast....
     
  13. oicdn

    oicdn Guest

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    And if it's of any help, if the wheel is coasting, and I put it to the hardspot, the trademark king buzz, gets LOUDER......don't think that'll really help any, but the wheel also doesn't slow any faster, just the noise gets louder.....
     
  14. RomanR

    RomanR DualDisc 26"

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    It sounds like they torqued the hell out of the adjuster cone when they put it together, and now something inside is binding. The bearing preload, on both normal and HD axles is only supposed to be finger tight, and it's possible that your shop might have tightened it as hard as they could or something. First I was gonna suggest that the chain was adjusted correctly, but the problem sounded more serious than that. So yea, watch the videos on the King site and read the manual, and redo the bearing preload.

    As for the noise getting louder part, mine does that too, though there is no binding of any sort. When I coast i can tell how many times the wheel has turned because the noise changes like some sort of sound wave, up and down. Other people's Kings I ride with do this too, so maybe it's got something to do with everything inside the hubs not being absolutely 100% round and faced perfectly to each other with 0% error. So the noise isn't something to be worried about I don't think, but in your case the noise comes with mad binding, so it's most likely the bearing preload done up too tight.
     
  15. Mehukatti

    Mehukatti Guest

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    king rear hubs needs a breakin' period every time after it is disassembled/assembled.
     
  16. Zyzzyx

    Zyzzyx Guest

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    I know CK hubs are great, and I still would like to have one (or two), but threads like this make me even more pleased with my White Industries freewheel.
     
  17. tomacropod

    tomacropod Rum Pig

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    Roman may have something, the ringdrive can be impeded if the bearing preload is overtightened. Kill bearings too. Although OICDN said that the axle turned smoothly...hmmm...just take it apart dude, sounds like all's not right. Don't take it back to the same serviceman either, he should have checked it before giving it back to you.

    - Joel
     
  18. xxxfr

    xxxfr RCP FABRICATION

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    i hate people that charge you to fuck up your very expensive bikes.......u just gotta work on ur own stuff man
     
  19. AndyT

    AndyT New Member

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    Never bring your bike to that horrible shop again and learn to do it yourself.
     
  20. B1105

    B1105 New Member

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    Yea bring it to mine and I'll charge you $700

    Not, but take eveyrone's advide, get a book on bike mechanics for $20, read it, and learn to do everything you wanted to know. I think youd ahve to be incredibly retarted to actually physically break a king hub(sorry if anyone is retarted, no offense meant). If you get really fucked up and cant figure it out, then I cant help you.