DeSalvo.vs.Planet-X [Archive] - ObservedTrials.net

bryco8

07-20-2004, 08:54 PM

i currently own a planet-x bommer. i wanna start trials and want a trials specific bike. i either want to buy a planet-x zebdi(couldn't get a pic.) or a DeSalvo stock trials bike(not positive what the model name is!?)
http://biketrials.com/cgi-bin/lsqldev-2.1.2/jump.cgi?view=Image&ID=69

i'm willing to spend money and get really into trials so what frame do you guys think i should buy

Andreas

07-20-2004, 09:25 PM

de salvo hands down, i wouldn't even consider the PX if those were my options.

Elan

07-20-2004, 09:30 PM

i dont think mike still makes that model of trials frame... you could order one, but i think he is doing a production run of his new model frame:

http://www.observedtrials.net/otn/DES1.JPG

Elan

07-20-2004, 09:33 PM

oops.. anyways, that bike is my cousin's. it rides very well, and is built very well.

i wouldnt even consider the planet x zebdi unless i were a pure street style trials rider.

if you are going to get into pure trials, the desalvo is an excellent choice. its geometry is borrowed from the koxx XTP, a top of the line trials specific frame.

bryco8

07-20-2004, 09:44 PM

i dont know if this is a stupid question because im just starting but can you get a DeSalvo with a bashguard (one on the frame?)

Elan

07-20-2004, 09:47 PM

im sure you could if you really wanted to. desalvo is a custom biek builder... it would take while to build (like 2-9 months) and cost more though.

Elan

07-20-2004, 09:57 PM

forgot to add one more thing: if you are considering a "pure" trials frame like the new desalvo. it isnt the only one like that that exists, so if you want to have a choice,there are a few more bikes like it that you may want to follow up on:

www.factionbike.com (http://www.factionbike.com) / www.webcyclery.com (http://www.webcyclery.com)
koxx levelboss
koxx xtp
koxx caisso
echo pure
coustellier

www.btbikes.com (http://www.btbikes.com)
BT raven

im sure there are a few more notable mentions i forgot...

bryco8

07-20-2004, 10:03 PM

two other subjects i need to clear up

1. in some pictures i see a red knob on the brake lever... i was wandering what that was for

and

2 being a beginner, would a normal seat(mtb seat) affect weight, balance, or movement or anything else or should i just start out with one of those 2" by 3" pieces of carbon fiber?

Elan

07-20-2004, 10:08 PM

1: if its on maguras, its for "turbo pad adjustment", which is just basically a set screw that displaces fluid in the mastr cylinder.

2: seats really dont make any difference as long as they arent in your way. i suggest not using a seat if you are riding "trials" some people claim they want a seat because they commute to their riding spots or whatever... i highly doubt using a seat on a trials bike is all that great compared to just standing up and not having to deal with the piece of shit while you are riding. i have had two trials bikes without seat post holes, never once did i wish i had a seat.

bryco8

07-20-2004, 10:18 PM

thanx a lot

AgrAde

07-20-2004, 11:44 PM

i'm surprised noone has asked the same old questions such as
1) height, weight?
3) what kinda of riding do you want to be doing?

Andreas

07-20-2004, 11:46 PM

de salvo is custom, he can get whatever geometry he wants, which means that he can get street style geometry as well.

steel is real, the bike will hold up to big guys just fine.

Elan

07-20-2004, 11:49 PM

omg, thanks for pointing that out anreas. captain fucking obvious.

anyways.. agrade points out some very useful stuff.

Andreas

07-21-2004, 12:09 AM

Elan

07-21-2004, 12:22 AM

well what the fuck if he orders a 1085mm desalvo and he is 5'5...he will come back here, as he should, complaning about it because it rides like shit. omg.... certain users should have exclusive rights to mamaru and greddies

Andreas

07-21-2004, 12:30 AM

well what the fuck if he orders a 1085mm desalvo and he is 5'5this is soo gay, the point of custom geometry is to get it to fit you. and not once did i tell him to get a 1085 wb. omg, not my fault. holy shit, this is gay

seattletrials

07-21-2004, 01:31 AM

I'd go with the desalvo no questions about it. because mike makes each frame indevidually, you can get little things changed with it. you could get a mod with a frame bash guard, or the stock frame like the one in the picture up there. I'm sure you could somehow get a frame bash guard on a stock frame. not sure how much that would throw off the geometry though.

The trials frame that is in the picture up there has the 1085 wheelbase, that's kinda the standard that Mike does, but you can most likly get it shorter or longer depending on how tall you are, but i've heard that a 1085 wheelbase works well for almost anyone. But I'd say if you're willing to shell out the cash for a desalvo. DO IT! You'll never look back. I know someone that has the older style(with the seat) and it rides like a dream. another plus with getting a desalvo, is that you can get any color you want, or a rad paint job(i.e. flames, stars, maple leafs, whatever your heart desires). The guys down at spectrum powderworks that powdercoats his frames are exelent.

My Desalvo should be showing up sometime within the next week or so. I can't wait.

Bloodhound

07-21-2004, 01:56 AM

my post was talking about agrade's comments. his height is fine considering he can change the geo. to his liking. his weight is fine because steel will be perfectly strong enough for him no matter his weight. if he wants to do street riding or UCI/natural riding or BIU riding, he can change the frame to suit his needs. so i'm saying that the de salvo will be fine no matter what numbers/styles answer agrade's question.

:momaru:
Changing the geo at all means an almost completely custom bike. This will take very long to get built and will cost very much.

"his weight is fine because steel will be perfectly strong enough for him no matter his weight" heh, ok buddy :ugh:

Andreas

07-21-2004, 02:02 AM

omg, keep on responding to every fucking thing i say. i will make sure to point out every mistake you make in typing your post next time :momaru:
jeremy's frame held up fine for the while he used it, and he is known to break frames left and right.
PX's are shit anyways, they're known for cracking around the BB area, so between the two i'd still say de salvo.

EDIT-at least somebody knows what they're talking about. seattletrials thank you for your common sense!

seattletrials

07-21-2004, 02:06 AM

"DeSalvo Custom Cycles" custom meaning every frame is a custom hand built frame. So every frame is completley custom. he has "models" to chose from so people can get a rough idea of geometry, but then with a semi custom frame, you can still mess with the geometry. and you can also arange to get thicker tubing if you'r a big guy. the ones that Mike was making for Jeremy V. were sub 3.5lb frames, true they didnt' last very long, but its possible, and if you're a big guy, you can get a 5 lb frame to last you longer. all by changing the thickness of the tubing.

Bloodhound

07-21-2004, 02:08 AM

oh, your just anoyed cuz I gave you the :ugh: look.

There was a few remarks about desalvo's custom framing which I felt were over casualized. Making any custom bike frame, even just changing the geo of an existing one, is quite a procedure, not the everymans option.

Elan

07-21-2004, 02:25 AM

jeremy is also known for not knowing how to put a crank on a xtp

[BMF]Andy

07-21-2004, 05:54 AM

If you are just starting out in trials I suggest the Planet X over the Desalvo. The PX comes with great all around trials geometry, is relatively sturdy, and is backed by pretty much the best warranty around (2 years, plus 5 year crash replcaement).

People have mentioned many of the benefits of getting a Desalvo and mostly they come from it being a "custom" bike. This means you have to know exactly what you want, and knowing what you want simply requires experience on a trials bike.

And if you did decide on a certain style of trials bike that you wanted; With the amount of production trials frames on the market today you are bound to find one that comes close to what you are looking for without going through the hassle and waiting that comes from a custom build.

I ride a Desalvo myself and like it but I rode a PX for my first three years on a trials bike and i dont think i could have picked a better bike to start on.

dingus

07-21-2004, 10:18 AM

People have mentioned many of the benefits of getting a Desalvo and mostly they come from it being a "custom" bike I ride a Desalvo myself and like it but I rode a PX for my first three years on a trials bike and i dont think i could have picked a better bike to start on.
I can almost say 'ditto'.

I dont think youll learn trials faster on an XTP or otherwise a $1000 custom or comp frame. You may be able to roll that wheelbase up slightly higher objects etc. but you wont develope technique faster- I dont believe. The truth is you wont be slapping up somehting giacomo style anytime soon, youll learn to hop around like dork- like we all did before we could start to appreciate the finer things, and that will take a few years.:joshers: :joshers: :joshers: :joshers: :joshers: :joshers: :joshers: :joshers:

TTownJon

07-21-2004, 10:44 AM

Andy']If you are just starting out in trials I suggest the Planet X over the Desalvo. The PX comes with great all around trials geometry, is relatively sturdy, and is backed by pretty much the best warranty around (2 years, plus 5 year crash replcaement).

People have mentioned many of the benefits of getting a Desalvo and mostly they come from it being a "custom" bike. This means you have to know exactly what you want, and knowing what you want simply requires experience on a trials bike.

And if you did decide on a certain style of trials bike that you wanted; With the amount of production trials frames on the market today you are bound to find one that comes close to what you are looking for without going through the hassle and waiting that comes from a custom build.

I ride a Desalvo myself and like it but I rode a PX for my first three years on a trials bike and i dont think i could have picked a better bike to start on.
Agreed. Also, there is nothing in the original post implying that he wants to do competition or purely natural trials. Why not ride a shorter, cheaper bike that will allow him to decide what kind of style he wants while still allowing just as good if not better progression at the lower level? (holy shite that is a long sentence :hsugh: ) If in six months time he decides he would really benefit by getting a longer bike, it would be easy enough to sell the px and find a used (or new) longer bike.

If you are really willing to shell out the cash, Id say start out on a short bike (like the px) and then move to a longer bike (like the desalvo) once you will really benefit from it.

My 2 Cents.

xxxfr

07-21-2004, 10:55 AM

my first real trials bike is my zebdi, its freaking awesome, coming off a giant stp frame and 2" suspension fork, i notice the geo right off the bat.......i still have plans to get a custom peyto down the road, but i feel you have to ride 3 or 4 frames to know what geometry your going to want...
Im not even sure if my next frame will be a custom, i would like to get a season on a longer frame, like a 1040 wheelbase or something, just to see, if i hate it, ill know to stick w/ the 1010 or something inbetween the two.
So yea, for a newbie, under 3 years of trialsin id say to NOT get a custom frame that your designing. If you have a frame designed and built for you, then go for it, youll prolly love it.

bryco8

07-21-2004, 11:15 AM

thanks guys

digby

07-21-2004, 11:37 AM

PX's are shit anyways, they're known for cracking around the BB area, so between the two i'd still say de salvo.

holy crap, how would you know anyways. You dont ride stock and youve never had a planet x. How many people do you know of that have actually cracked px's? Yes when they crack its around the bb, but its not too common, the only person I know thats done it is tony F and he's always trying crazy shit, also most anything else(aside from the koxx hes riding now) would also have cracked too. The fact that he rode it for another year after welding it says alot about it.

DeSalvo is not the endall solution for everything and everyone just cuz its custom. Aside from the fact that it will cost easily double what the px will go for, how will he know what geometry to get? Hes a beginner, he can probably bunny hop, a uci frame will kill that. Super Short chainstays and long front end, probably wont be able to take advantage of that until he's got a couple years of riding under his belt(unless hes related to graham). Everyones telling him to get a desalvo or a uci type frame and he's asking if he can get a bashguard on it.

Get a px, they are great bikes and theres nothing wrong with them. Half the riders or more on this board started off on them. You dont need a $900+ frame to learn the basics of trials. Get the px, learn how to ride trials, beat the living hell out of it and when your smoother, if you want to ride a uci style frame, then switch to a desalvo.

klophaus

07-21-2004, 11:54 AM

I've never had a long bike, but have had a zebdi. Agree with it being a nice bike to learn on. I will say, don't buy a new one. I've seen used frames on ebay for $150 and I don't think there have been any huge improvements over the older ones.. There are quite a few floating around because it does seem to be everyones first frame. So save yourself the extra cash or pick up a king hub. Later you can decide if you want a longer bike.

bryco8

07-21-2004, 12:09 PM

right know im a tiny kid 5'5" and about 110lbs. .......if that would help with geometry configurations

oh yah and i have a PX bommer should i use that or sell it?

bryco8

07-21-2004, 12:12 PM

now*

and if i should use my bommer what should i use for components-or how should i set the bike up?

digby

07-21-2004, 01:02 PM

if you go with a px, your bomber or a zebdi or a tibo, spend the extra money on some quality components and you'll notice alot more difference there.

Get good brakes, for v brakes - go with avids or xtr, since you weigh so little and the zebdi mk5 has a beefy ass disc mount you could run full discs on that. Go with avid mechanicals or maybe avid juicys.

Your very light so you could probably get away with running any hub you want and not have to worry about the pawls or the hub itself dying on you, if you want quick engagment and want to shell out the dough get a king hub or a white industries trials freewheel. If its not totatlly important to you get a profile or a dt/hugi hub.

Nikolai

07-21-2004, 01:18 PM

the only person I know thats done it is tony F
*sniff*

You know me... Or so I thought!

digby

07-21-2004, 01:31 PM

crap, forgot about that one.

"its not what you said its how you said it" :greddy:

Bloodhound

07-21-2004, 01:50 PM

uownme

07-21-2004, 02:53 PM

i still have plans to get a custom peyto down the road, but i feel you have to ride 3 or 4 frames to know what geometry your going to want...

I would have to agree. Coming from a pitbull to a BT, Im thinking that the longer-ness may be making me suck more. The superlongness is too long for my shortness (5'8"). Or maybe I am just looking for a excuse for why I suck alot recently. Maybe I will go back to a shorter style frame...

AndyT

07-21-2004, 03:01 PM

Probably around 70% of the zebdi frames sold in england have snapped...but they are english, and not pansy fucks like us.

B1105

07-21-2004, 06:36 PM

the above statement is true, so whichever douche said PXs snap, if your in the US , dont worry about it. i only say this as I like my PX and I suck at trials. Once again, PX's don't suck, especially if your into doing street.

my 2 cents

AgrAde

07-21-2004, 06:49 PM

the guy weighs 110lb. imho get a zebdi with a 100x5 stem, low/medium rise bars...

xxxfr

07-21-2004, 07:47 PM

yea, freaking 110lbs, im near double that, and i like to say im fairly smooth.....after i get a line 5 or 6 times :ugh:................:rofl:

anyway, i like the geo on the newer old zebdis mk3 i think to mk5, and the mk6 is very nice, due to the new tubing, and the geo change that px says doesnt exist......

out of the 3 mk6 frames ive seen, the stays are 15.4", not 15.5, and the wheelbase is 40.25" not 40.15"

bryco8

07-21-2004, 08:43 PM

ive mechanical disks on my bommer(hayes) and what kind of crank and bars should i use...and the big "Q"=singlespeed or multispeed
______________________________________
:squint:BO!

B1105

07-21-2004, 09:29 PM

wide bars - azonic doublewalls, tryalls, woodmans TT, titecs, anything above 27.5" should do fine

cranks - 170mm length IMO, something liek FSA V Drive Extremes/Tru Vativ Hussefelts, those are cheap and pretty strong

bryco8

07-21-2004, 09:35 PM

i have a hussefelt but it like a 32 tooth ring should i get a smaller ring and a different rear casset?

bryco8

07-21-2004, 09:36 PM

and what kind of stem and fork should i use?(id like a rigid)

bryco8

07-21-2004, 09:40 PM

oh yah, sorry, one more, what rims and tyres should i buy because i warped my rims today doin like a two foot drop.....they're just cheap and they suck

xxxfr

07-21-2004, 09:48 PM

fork......any cromoly rigid fork will do, ummm 400mm-420mm is used mostly.
rims...dx32 rear, cheap, wide and strong, dx32 front if you dont mind the weight, or are using your bike for more than just trials.... tires.....hmmm, right now i swith between a 2.5 hot s and a 2.6 geax 6 ply for the rear, and a 2.5 and 2.1 hot s for the front depending on what im doing....
22 tooth max up front
12-21 ultegra road cassette is the best for the rear
get a 22t max bash guard as well

RomanR

07-21-2004, 10:12 PM

I wouldn't recommend the Ultegra cassette, especially if you're just starting out and learning pedal kicks. I've heard of plenty of people who have sheared their trials gear right off the carrier, which would be pretty painful if it happened during a big move, much like a chain breaking. Any road cassette with the cog size range xxxfr suggested will be fine, dropping big bucks on an Ultegra or DuraAce cassette won't make your bike any better.

Sora, Tiagra, 105 etc. Be sure it has an 18, 19, and 21 tooth cogs, maybe 20 too, since those are the gears most riders use with 22 chainrings, so this would give you a few gears to try out to see which one you prefer.

digby

07-21-2004, 10:39 PM

lightweight drill out road cassette with cutouts to save even more weight + trials = introduction of your balls to your stem.

get the 7spd shimano cassette from tim at trialsin usa. cheap and its solid, dont have to worry about breaking it.

oh wait, forgot you only weight 100 pounds, you could go with a ti casstte if you wanna blow your money, no way you'd break it.