cross post: a bike trials website doctrine

[DanBowhers]

Posted this 10 seconds ago on BT enjoy the biggest, more articulate flame of maeder ever:

I don’t know if this will even be addressed publicly, but I hope it does. I think this site has definitely lost it’s edge that much can be agreed upon by almost all of the riders who have been around for more than a year or two. However, instead of complaining about it, I will bring it to your attention why and then continue my patronage of observedtrials.net.

The difference between this site and other trials website (including online stores like try-all America, or trialsin.com) is the subtle (to some) use of capital and consumerism. Before, this site reported on more pressing issues like competitions and fun rides. I don’t know if I am losing my touch with what bike trials is about (after all I have been riding street more *gasp*) but I liked reading about fun rides and competitions a ton more than the latest part from echo/zoo!

Trialsin USA and Try All America are stores. They distribute parts and bikes to the masses and offer clearly objective (for the most part) reviews and honest advice. For example, I was interested in the Author A-Gang, but Tim at Trialsin steered me away from it because he knew the top tube would be way too short for my 6 4 body even though it cost him a sale. I do think however that this site would still recommend the echo cranks to me if I told them I plan on doing crank arm slides on concrete ledges with them…objectivity? No. Heck, Graham, the owner of try all told me I would be killer on a desalvo, he possibly sacrificed a sale to give objective advice on a bike. That’s a product review.

Why no objectivity? You (Senor Maeder) ride for or at least are getting copious amounts of echo/zoo! parts and frames. Now I may be wrong and you are paying for them at full price (which would not make sense seeing how little use these bits seem to get, but I wont make an assumption on your economic standing. Regardless this site is ridiculous in its proliferation of product reviews. Its just like an sub site to Echo and Zoo!

Well you are probably thinking my analysis of this site is either mean or over the top or that I am bad for bike trials for bringing such a cynical outlook into this sport that you try to market for 6 year olds, but you know what? This is truth, you want to make your site better? Go back to how it was. Report on fun rides, getting in trouble, looking for brake pads, whatever all of that was leaps and bounds more interesting than what is going on here now. My point of view will get totally overlooked in favor of “progress” towards an even more consumer oriented world of bike trials, but whatever I tried. Perhaps you want a squeaky clean look for trials where the bikes and parts look off the showroom floor, but realistically the rest of us ride, fall, dent parts, brake frames, get bloody and cuss when we do so, we are trials, you are a businessman trying to cash in.

-Dan Bowhers

[RomanC]

What you have to remember is that running a site costs money. So if you don't have a money generating scheme the site can't stay alive. A big objective site can't sustain itself unless you ask the users to pay up. But everybody expects everything on the internet to be free so this won't work. So BT caters to Echo/Zoo! so that Stephen can get free shit and possibly get some mula to pay for the site. OT is sponsored by Webcyclery to cover up the costs. So even if the reviews on BT are skewed you still have to go through a vendor to buy the product, and the vendor might help you out more like in the examples you have described.

At any rate my point is that you can't bitch about consumerism and expect a free site with lots of features.

[jimmybikes]

Dan, I think you have made so valid points. On the other hand he deserves to be rewarded for all of his efforts too!

I hope Stephen,will use your comments to do both, make money and improve the site by giving the readers more of what they are looking for.

I don't think it is an either or case.

I did not see this posted on BT site, did you post it?

By the way, I do repect what Stephen has done, he was the first and best site for many years, and he still has a good site, that is geared to people with families that want to be more selective about what their kids read.

Jim VanSchoonhoven

[DanBowhers]

First dude,

I dont expect lots of features, just simple stuff like um biketrials riding?

Jim,

As always good post. Yes this was posted, in the suggestions part so as to reduce the chances of it becomming an all out online war. I posted it here so andrewt (and anyone else banned) could have a chance to read it.

I have given stephen respect. His old site ruled. When he recognized the development of his riding, not the Echo/Zoo! line it was cool to read about. If you read his old stuff you can see a development from beginner to expert. To me that is A. A whole lot cheaper to produce and B. a whole lot more interesting.

[AndyT]

Just stop posting there and let the site die. It would flourish, if 90% of trials riders were straight edge 2 to 6 year olds.


Who on earth would censor words that they play during the day ON THE DISNEY CHANNEL. Where does stephan think he is? The internet is not a place to enforce your unreasonable ideals of purity and conduct.

Two clicks later and anyone can see japanese women shitting eels onto babies faces....but its good that he protects the (any??) children from seeing every day words like damn. :ugh2:

[DanBowhers]

eat my death,

I agree with everything you said (except the comment about straight edge kids who I dont think have anything to do with purity and not swearing) I guess my post was just a last fuck you to him and an explanation as to why his site is dying.

[afrobot]

I looked for it but I think it has been "Maederated" :down:

[Gardenfan]

It is in the site suggestions forum.

[BrettM]

I don't think Dan is saying Stephen shouldn't take money from zoo and echo and such. But he needs to spread it around more. Right now all the updates are incredibly self serving. They are aboots him and his sponsors and comps he goes to. No offence but that is not a National or International site.

I can't remember the last time I actually checked out an update because it never has a damn thing to do with anything I'd even a little bit be interested in.

I don't know the inside story or anything and this is only my own personal guess. The site used to kick a bit of ass before it was after the money. It got big and he saw dollar signs. Now he's after nothing but that and leaving the things out that most people go there for. That's where this site is way different. Matt can try to cover his costs, hell maybe even try to make a buck or two, and it doesn't mess with anything. It's still very diverse and you are allowed a different opinion and all that.

[Elan]

i have been banned from that site like 5 times... every tiem i check in to see whats happening, there are two-week old posts still in the top 3 msot recent threads.... it is dieing, slowly, but surely....i am not going to say anything

[Gardenfan]

somebody should pull the plug.

i have been warned and threatened a couple times for saying the word crap

oh no crap, mommmy my eyes are burning!

[DanBowhers]

BRETT YOU HIT IT ON THE NOSE. THANK YOU

[TooSicKs]

poop

[Andreas]

i used to check it everyday, then after a while stephen just started telling me subtly that i couldn't say anything bad about zoo (through pms etc). i can't say crap-EVEN IF I SAY IT LIKE THIS: C$R!.AP#$.
stephens a homo, werd
that' site is dying, werd

[sebLG]

stephen's site has indeed been maederated. i too use to check it heaps, now i go look at it but i never bother posting it is just completely futile. usually when i do post it makes some sad doownad need a whaaa-ambulance so stephen pm's me saying not to say that ... thats why his fucking site is dying, he wont let anybody say anything (except for jim vaschoovhen[sp?] coz his posts are just always so good). all his site is is annoying questions and annoying answers ... anyway, like i said, his site deserves to die because nobody can really say anything. the only time i post there is when i post pics of my biike to get compliments on it.

stephen is a fagmobot :gaybar:

[Fast Fashion]

just don't post there.