Sub 9kg (19.842lbs) 26" bike competition ready trials bike.

[TRA]

Yes , this is what i want to try and do . sub 9kg (19.842lbs)high level 26" bike.

My coust V2 now weighs 9.5(20.955lbs) kg , and i think i can make it a little lighter but not much.

The bike has to be fairly strong and ready to be ridden at world level.

What parts do you think would be best for this bike ?

My quick list of items would be .

KOXX hydroxx

Tryall rims drilled etc,
alu nipples with tryall singlespeed rear hub.

american classic front hub

V-brakes for front, rear?

syntace stem\bar

magnesium pedals with tryall crank arms

tryall front tire, schwalbe big betty rear tire ?

ti bolts.

etc

discuss

[AndyT]

Only wheel I've ever tacod was alum nippled...but I honestly couldn't believe it.

american classics bearings are supposed to go out fairly fast- whether that happens in trials is a mystery to me.

[Giant1118]

hs 33 will be lighter on the back then adaptors and v brakes.

I can see how it can be done. Just drill the shit out of stuff, if its a comp only bike then it shouldnt have to last forever

[Eisbein]

V brake in front with a cannondal p bone dont need a Brake booster, and the fork is only 860g.
if you can use it without snake bites use a nobby nic front tire.
maybe use shimano hollowtech 2 crank system. i think there is an possebility to run it with an screw on cog.
if you have a friend who can german we have a thread about saving weight...

[trauma100]

If your bench pressing tree stumps I dont think that extra couple pounds will make that much difference :dunno:

[Stikman]

Alu double butted spokes
Shortest Kool chain you can run with the smallest gears you can use and still maintain your ideal ratio.
Drill holes in your pedals, or machine them aka Hermance
Otherwise everything else sounds good.

You thought about carbon DH bars???

[TRA]

Nobody says i am going to ride this bike, might just be a pride on my wall

Syntace has some carbon ones now, i think i will get some

[Sondre]

Schwalbe Big Betty 2.4 rear tire, linky (http://www.cyclecomponents.com/cgi-bin/air_ibutik.fcgi?avd=&Ref=&funk=visa_artikel&artnr=SCHW010-GGr) if you dont find it anywhere.
Square cut-outs in rims, both front and rear


I've used an american Classic hub for quite a while now, and it is still smooth as a baby's butt. I am even using the lightest one, (which I assume Thomas is going to use aswell) and it only weighs ~50g

[Luriks]

Try-All tire at front? No way!
I am sure you can find something lighter. Continental maybe? Michelin?
- 2.35 rear tire (kenda maybe)
- Michelin latex inner tubes
- 1.8mm spokes or less
- don't use rimtapes :) (make sure there are no sharp ages on the EXTRA drilled rims)
- kmc super light chain
- foam grips
- titanium bolts (cut them shorter)
- drill some holes in brakemounts, cranks, uper tube of the fork, cut your handlebar shorter, remove paint from your frame and parts etc ... :)

Try not to kill yourself on that bike, as we all like your movies :)

[Cryo-Cube]

Syntace has a fork that is fairly light compared to how stiff and strong it is.
798g. Not that pricey either.

[FoxRacer]

well... IMO it should be pretty easy to do just some cash needs to be involved

- magnesium rims would be way forward! (btw wouldn't echo hub be lighter?)
- echo control fork or pace carbon (atom has done in 2002 titanium trials fork - 678g)
- machined down hollowtech I deore cranks (330g pair)
- onza carbon bar
- light stem
- foam grips
- double dengura will be lighter than vees (avid ultimate brake + ultimate lever is more than dengura including 4bolts)
- Tryall front tire is over kill just find somewhere hot s which was about 570g and pretty much pinch resistant. For rear... worn down el gato, it's about 700g:D

P.S.

I also want to do it soon. I'm just afraid that bike when built will be a lot heavier than expected

[Chris]

Just buy this for your current bike and you'll easily get <9kg

Schwalbe Nobby Nic front, Schwalbe xxlight tube
Schwalbe Big Betty gooey gluey rear, xlight tube

That saved me around 700g over the Maxxis tires and standard Schwalbe tubes, which I had before..

If you want to go all custom, the hydroxx won't be the best choice, as it won't be lighter than your current coustellier... I'd go for the ozonys - lightest comp frame at the moment. If you want something even lighter, go for a custom made triton ti frame or one of those 1050g magnalium DOB frames from China...

besides:

DT revolution or Sapim x-ray spokes on drilled (square holes) tryall rear rim and a mavic x??? front rim
if you need a light 128mm bb: truvativ giga pipe team sl
tryall cranks and magn. pedals
hs33s front and back
2006 Echo control fork
syntace vro bar/stem combo

Vincent's bike is drilled to the max and the only parts where he could save another 500g are the tires.

So I'd say 8,5-9kg is the min for a stock bike, unless you want to go all crazy and drill the poop out of your bike and use flimsy carbon parts all over the place, which will make your bike feel like a wet noodle...

[Eisbein]

well... IMO it should be pretty easy to do just some cash needs to be involved

- magnesium rims would be way forward! (btw wouldn't echo hub be lighter?)
- echo control fork or pace carbon (atom has done in 2002 titanium trials fork - 678g)
- machined down hollowtech I deore cranks (330g pair)
- onza carbon bar
- light stem
- foam grips
- double dengura will be lighter than vees (avid ultimate brake + ultimate lever is more than dengura including 4bolts)
- Tryall front tire is over kill just find somewhere hot s which was about 570g and pretty much pinch resistant. For rear... worn down el gato, it's about 700g:D

P.S.

I also want to do it soon. I'm just afraid that bike when built will be a lot heavier than expected
you can get Vs which are much lighter. cant beleve the those shitty chinese copy of magura are lighter then Vs

[F_K]

IRC ElGato on rear?
It is light. It's not good, but it's light.

[Cryo-Cube]

On a lot of normal BBs you can also drill out the middle shell of your BB without weakening it much or at all.

It would looks something like this:

[dannyboy]

my koxx karbon is 9.3kg ...
magura on rear (was lot lighter then vee, adaptor, booster etc)
vee on front


the lightest setup i can think of is this
easton carbon bar 225gms
fsa xc115os stem (138gms!)
same as wat u got but with these...
kinesis fork 740gms!
or white bros carbon or maybe the coust carbon fork (fournales?)
tyres ... ritchey do a wcs i use on the front (dry only!) 380gms
rear schwable or the new conti 2.35 and 680gms forget wat its called.
All TI bolts makes a big diff too..

add me on msn if u wanna discuss
dannyboy@biketrials.com
im confident i can make mine sub 9 without too much trouble :)

[someone]

syncros flt front tire or kenda blue groove 2.0 470 gr with stick e side knobs, syncros or kenda single ply rear tires, 785gr to 875gr sitck e compound chris king headset ,ti pedal axles. truvativ sl doesn't come in 128mm.

[Chris]

truvativ sl doesn't come in 128mm.

It does! I had one... 281g - can't beat that!

[spartan1]

yo i would deffinately say go for vees front and rear. Rear vees have a bad rap but i have got the best power of my life off vees, way better than maggies.
Hope i can help u man im a big fan of ur videos
PS: post a picture of the bike when its done

[hophopsnap]

carbon fork?

[dannyboy]

yo i would deffinately say go for vees front and rear. Rear vees have a bad rap but i have got the best power of my life off vees, way better than maggies.
Hope i can help u man im a big fan of ur videos
PS: post a picture of the bike when its done

I had vees on rear.. definately feel better then maggies (xtr levers, linear slick cables and ultimate arms) BUT, if TRA is going for light weight When i took my vee off including adaptor and carbon booster.. it was 114gms heavier then a simple rear magura..

sure i prefer the hold and power of vee but i wanted to see wat weight diff there is - so maggie on rear xtr on front :h5:

[CoppellStereo]

what about those new vbrakes by KCNC that are really light? im guessing the tail thing on the HYRDOXX is extra weight that shouldnt be there, maybe you should use a different frame, or cut off the tail? haha

[pav]

What about magnesium bashring, titanium cogs? Can you get these?

Also, what about a chris king rear hub, its 265g, isnt a tryall like 250g and then you still need another 250g or so for a freewheel?

Still use ffw cranks cos they are lighter and then just used a fixed cog.

Make sure oyu get magnesium pedal with titanium axles, not all magnesium pedals will take titanium pedal axles though.

Carbonfibre lever, if they're availible?

What about changing over all the fixtures and fittings on the magura to titanium or something, i think that they're all steel, like all the bleed bolts, barbed fittings, etc. Maybe change over hosing to something lighter too?

Titanium spokes & hub axles with 28h front rim?

Thats all i can think of at the moment?

[Ali C]

the try-all is somthing like 170g, I have a paul Word hub (rear screw on) that weighs 200g with bolts and 169 without.

[AndyT]

No one remembers...



Martin Kleivard




>*

[dannyboy]

haha i remembers him drilling out his cnc'd bits on the illions especially around the seat stay junction and the inside of his crank arms ... still to this day makes me laugh!!!!!

[AndyT]

still to this day the smoothest rider :bowdown:

[dannyboy]

^^^TRUE!^^^

dammit now im dreaming of crescents with black forks (flames on forks) and xtr cranks ... waaay light and super maad styliin ridiing!!

[Juhan]

The Try-All fixed rear hub is 182g, try-all freewheel is also ~180g so together it's about 360g, if you used a reagular classic Chris King that's 268g and a screw-on sprocket on the front that's about ~70g then it'd come together to 338g. Not much, but you finally have a reason to ride a KING ;)

[Monty99]

CK Headset saves about 40g to regular one.
light Grips
Aren't mono-caged VPs lighter then Wellgo Magnesium?

[pav]

What about the Ti king headset?

[netto]

what if you ride nothing? you can save another 9kg!

[FoxRacer]

you can get Vs which are much lighter. cant beleve the those shitty chinese copy of magura are lighter then Vs

They're lighter, Dengura - 311g.

avid ultimate lever - 150g
aviid ultimate brake - 188g
hose etc...
v-brake adapter...

So you are basicly WRONG:P


I had 2 times el gato for like one year (one lasted for ~6 months) and had like 4 pinch flats through this time?? ain't that bad, especially that I put yesterday Try-all on rear and had pinch after one year of having non (had maxxis)

[netto]

too bad denguras are the worst feeling brakes i've ever used.

[pav]

Are they worse than that feeling of dried/hardened fat melting & contaminating your hands which came out of an oven pan after cooking lamb chops?

[netto]

i dont even know what to say:hahano:

[www.biketrial-it.eu]

you can drill and grind the fork. at the end of the fork (dropouts) there are a piece of aluminium with a threaded hole...is useless, you can remove it.

you can drill magura clamp, magura lever, hope lever.

For the rim...i make a hollow like ermance, coustellier, benito...but at the both side of the nipples hole i do a hole. external wall 10mm, internal wall 8..


i want to say where dani comas found or build a internal pedal axle in titanium!!!!

what' s the measure of the headset? 1"? 1/4" 1/8"?

[Chris]

What about the Ti king headset?

heavier than the standard one..

[Eisbein]

They're lighter, Dengura - 311g.

avid ultimate lever - 150g
aviid ultimate brake - 188g
hose etc...
v-brake adapter...

So you are basicly WRONG:P


I had 2 times el gato for like one year (one lasted for ~6 months) and had like 4 pinch flats through this time?? ain't that bad, especially that I put yesterday Try-all on rear and had pinch after one year of having non (had maxxis)
okay. i think if you are using maguras use rb carbon levers if you get get those.
my drivetrain setup would be: XTR crank system somthing arround 730g with BB , chrisking rearhub, king cog, in fornt a alu cog (xtr)
and mayby a normal shifting chain or rohloff trials chain...

[Macbeth]

Easton CNT Monkeylight DH
Thomson Elite X4 Stem
Mavic Crossmax ST frontwheel
TryAll (drilled to fuck) rear rim and Hub
Maxxis AdVantage Exception Series 2.1 Tyre front
Geax Lobo Loco 2.35 TNT Soft'n'Sticky Rear tyre
TryAll Cranks with no bash, 16/13 ratio, TI rear cog.
HS33 Rear, Avid Juicy Ultimate w/180mm rotor front
Magnesium pedals

That shit would fucking smash 9kg

[rush]

Youre all so gay. :greddy:



;)

[aki]

Schwalbe Big Betty rear for sure. Wayyyyyyyy grippier in wet then Maxxis/Michelin plus much lighter.

I think someone mentioned ti bolts...everywhere :)

[Troy [Mr.Morda]]

Hey Thomas..

Frame - Koxx Boxx or Titanium Frame (in Russian we have some strong frames only 1.5 kg)


Fork - Cannondal p bone


Handlebar/Stem - Syntace


Cranks – Try-All


Freewheel – Try-All 16T


BB – FSA with titanium axle (its about 190 gram and very strong) and aluminum bolts


Pedals – some magnesium


Brakes – magura with RB-Design lever (carbon are very lighter).


Rims – Try-All on rear with big holes and Alex DX32 on front (with big holes its a little lighter than front Try-All but much more stronger).


Hubs – Rear - Try-All
Front – Soul Kozak (it’s only 76 gr but expensive)


Titanium spokes for front and rear wheel with alu nipples.


Tires – Front Schwalbe Fat Albert (lighter than Try-All)
Rear Schwalbe Big Betty


Chain – KMC model SL910 (its wide and strong but have holes and save 40 gr)

And of course all bolts must be titanium (Try-All set).

[KMT]

;411269']Rims – Try-All on rear with big holes and Alex DX32 on front (with big holes its a little lighter than front Try-All but much more stronger).


Tires – Front Schwalbe Fat Albert (lighter than Try-All)



New alex dx32: 790g, you can drill it to min. 600-650g.
Try all front: 587g.
But yes, use drilled dx32 rear.


Try to get Schwalbe King Jim. 2.35 and mine was below 600g.

[dannyboy]

this whole thread is getin freakin ridiculous!!!
... and i AM a weight weenie but jeeezus

my karbon is 9.3 for the amount of money ud av to spend to save a few100gms i really doubt itll make fkall difference... (although i do have a full ti bolt kit hehehe :P)

[Cryo-Cube]

i think most people in this thread dont car THAT much about weight (like me). We are just giving suggestions o TRAs ultra light bike project.
I would never run some 800g fag rear tire and i would never throw away money for Ti bolts.

[GarthMc]

What about the Ti king headset?

Ti is heavier that Al genius :slap:

[rav]

;411269']
Brakes – magura with RB-Design lever (carbon are very lighter).


Yeach but RB-Design lever with carbon body is out of production. Some riders had bleeding problem...RB improved new 2007 model and bleeding problem is fixed. Current body is ALLOY not CARBON

I have new 2007 levers in offer they are at two options:

Price: 91,5 EUR - Brake lever ERGO 1F /MAGURA- rim brakes/ powder color (Black or Red)
http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/3297/16leverergo1fblackandreqh5.jpg




AND FULL ANODIZED



Price: 99 EUR - Brake lever ERGO 1F /MAGURA- rim brakes/ black anodized
http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/9428/17leverergo1fblackanodibe5.jpg


Full anodized version is TOP cylinder is made of Titanium

[aki]

i think most people in this thread dont car THAT much about weight (like me). We are just giving suggestions o TRAs ultra light bike project.
I would never run some 800g fag rear tire and i would never throw away money for Ti bolts.

Schwalbe Big Betty's are a bit pricey but it's worth the money. Strong sidewalls, Gooey Gluey compound that sticks like a glue and only weighs 890 grams. Never had a pinch flat with Try-All XL rear. (maybe once on a sharp rock) Try it! The only drawback with those sticky tires like Try-All is that they do wear out fast especially if you ride urban.

[konrad]

if you dont wont to ride it,that fork is your first choice:steinbach superlight-580g:ugh2:
http://www.bikepalast.com/images/product_images/info_images/8167_0.jpg

[Janson]

Rav: Those RB levers look very nice. Do they have smaller master cylinders like the older ones?

[Chris]

if you dont wont to ride it,that fork is your first choice:steinbach superlight-580g:ugh2:


Ever heard of a space after ", . : ! ?"??? That pisses me off on the german forum as well. All of your posts look like that! Check your spelling dude...

[GarthMc]

Ever heard of a space after ", . : ! ?"??? That pisses me off on the german forum as well. All of your posts look like that! Check your spelling dude...

It's just ruthless German efficiency :P

[aki]

Front tire...the new Schwalbe Black Shark Mud heavy duty version comes in at 570 grams & also uses the same Gooey Gluey compound. 2.25 Website only shows the ORC vesion but the GG version came out for 07.

http://www.schwalbetires.com/node/76/ok

[Chris]

the tire you mentioned is actually 890g :)

[aki]

the tire you mentioned is actually 890g :)

My mistake.

Schwalbe said because it's heavy duty it's actually 1,200 grams for the Black Shark Mud. for 2.25.....wow:?.

Though the ORC compound version is 570 grams which isn't bad at all. I just didn't find the ORC to be as sticky as the Gooey Gluey.

[afrobot]

Since you may not ride it anyway. Bashring size wont matter. If you have clearance for a 22t ring, get some old '05 XTR cranks grind off all arms of the spider ,then make a bashguard that acts as a bb spacer. It wil need to cup over the frame so the cups dont break.You will need a bigger cog on the back. Get a boone Ti . They only cost 83 godzillion dollarz. I would be running them myself but I have a 120 bb shell. I now have an excuse to build a new frame.

[Carbon]

You can use ceramic bearings. You can get them for hubs and bb's and a few other things. Also smaller frame size, narrow wheels and tires would work too.

[Giant1118]

ya 14inch frame is lighter then 21 inch frame...forgot about that

[gibrancurtiss]

SO , this topic gave me an idea.

i can built a web application that anyone could insert the part , wheight and picture.
then , you could build your own bike selecting the parts and the application calculate the final wheight...

but i do not have a server to host it. if anyone interested , contact me.

see ya

[Ebon Dragon]

SO , this topic gave me an idea.

i can built a web application that anyone could insert the part , wheight and picture.
then , you could build your own bike selecting the parts and the application calculate the final wheight...

but i do not have a server to host it. if anyone interested , contact me.

see ya

Microsoft Excel + Tartybikes (and likewise) + Weightweenies

[gibrancurtiss]

i forgot the excel dude!!!
i m gonna do some search to build it .
thankx

[www.biketrial-it.eu]

SO , this topic gave me an idea.

i can built a web application that anyone could insert the part , wheight and picture.
then , you could build your own bike selecting the parts and the application calculate the final wheight...

but i do not have a server to host it. if anyone interested , contact me.

see ya

if you want, i can give you my user & password of my site.

you can upload the application. i create a new blank page...and you can do all you want!!!

i have infinity space on my site!!

[gibrancurtiss]

hi biketrial

i built an html / javascript based calculator .
check the thread
http://www.observedtrials.net/vb/showthread.php?t=30468

thank you !!!

[guumer]

why not save the money and come to OTN days?

[pav]

Using your calculator, I got up to 5051g.

Adding everything up myself in excel, i got 11.869kg - how poo!

Still rides light and rides well though.

[mcdub]

No one remembers...



Martin Kleivard




>*


cresent/bianchi ftw
bodo's was under 20 pounds also.I believe to this day he might still have it in his bacement ???

my xtp was once upon a time 19.7 lbs internet spec

[www.biketrial-it.eu]

hi gibrancurtiss!!!

The calculator is great!!!


where you find the weight of piece? from internet?

[gibrancurtiss]

biketrial : from tarybikes site

c ya

[www.biketrial-it.eu]

now i build a front wheel...i use a HS33 front brake.

Try-all rim (drilled benito's style...) 28 hole
16mm. ergal nipples
DT swiss aerolite 2.0 spoke (radial configuration)
try-all "no disc" hub

i don't use a american classic hub because i need to use a quick relase...try-all hub weigh 91Gr...american 68...but with the QR the weight is more than 91Gr.


i want to change the headset...chris king is only 20Gr more light than cane creek...you know another headset?
cane creek = 123Gr...Chris King = 110Gr (i want a headset around 60Gr!!! chris king have it, but only in 1")

[tomacropod]

1 and 1/8" threadless headsets around 60g will have plastic cups. Just get a regular King and use the Ti baseplate.

- Joel

[dannyboy]

now i build a front wheel...i use a HS33 front brake.

Try-all rim (drilled benito's style...) 28 hole
16mm. ergal nipples
DT swiss aerolite 2.0 spoke (radial configuration)
try-all "no disc" hub

i don't use a american classic hub because i need to use a quick relase...try-all hub weigh 91Gr...american 68...but with the QR the weight is more than 91Gr.


i want to change the headset...chris king is only 20Gr more light than cane creek...you know another headset?
cane creek = 123Gr...Chris King = 110Gr (i want a headset around 60Gr!!! chris king have it, but only in 1")

use a ti skewer its definitely lighter :)

[pav]

use a ti skewer its definitely lighter :)


How the fuck is your bike so light? I have pretty light parts for everything except my frame and it weighs like 11.8kg. I rode my friends MBK which was 10.7 and we have NO IDEA how to make it any lighter - its a Evo 2 mbk as well. WTF!??!

[Oskar]

How the fuck is your bike so light? I have pretty light parts for everything except my frame and it weighs like 11.8kg. I rode my friends MBK which was 10.7 and we have NO IDEA how to make it any lighter - its a Evo 2 mbk as well. WTF!??!

tyres, tubes.

[dannyboy]

How the fuck is your bike so light? I have pretty light parts for everything except my frame and it weighs like 11.8kg. I rode my friends MBK which was 10.7 and we have NO IDEA how to make it any lighter - its a Evo 2 mbk as well. WTF!??!
is this directed at me??

every bolt is ti on my bike... down to m15 crank bolts, the end bolts on the brake backings heck even the brake bosses r ti, latex front tube, got a 340gm front tyre, (just ordered a 300gram lighter tyre for the rear) 130gm stem, but its not under 9!!! like TRAs will be :bowrofl:

[www.biketrial-it.eu]

1 and 1/8" threadless headsets around 60g will have plastic cups. Just get a regular King and use the Ti baseplate.

- Joel



???impossible...i have at home a CK headset...is wheigt = 110/108Gr. on chris king site the lightset headset is 68Gr and made only in 1".

By the way...in italy there are the http://www.extralite.com/ ...he have a real headset 68Gr and many components in titanium, 68Gr. hub...i ask to him if is possible to build a special titanium or Alu (7075) axis with threadto use the hub with bolt, no quick relase.

[durkie]

maybe consider these for a headset: http://www.bmeres.com/headsets.htm

two options: a 50gram one with aluminum oxide bushings/bearings and a 43gram one with plastic bushings/bearings.

[spartan1]

line your inner tuber with plastice then fill em with helium. That way youll get a little lift.
And you could talk funny on video

[trialsin usa]

As Andy T mentioned, there was Martin Kleivards bike. There was also Shaun Millers (under 20 pounds) and a few other riders. Then everyone demanded superlight bikes........then alot of people broke bikes.

[afrobot]

Take your current bike.Add 5lb depleted uranium weights to front and rear.Ride it for a month before a comp. Take them off. Sidehop the moon.:naughty:

[www.biketrial-it.eu]

maybe consider these for a headset: http://www.bmeres.com/headsets.htm

two options: a 50gram one with aluminum oxide bushings/bearings and a 43gram one with plastic bushings/bearings.


o my god!!! i have fear to use that headset!!

by the way...two day ago i buy & mount the Freehead 2 headset from www.extralite.com


is very strong...only 78Gr. (actual cane creeck 123Gr...Chris king 102Gr but the price is too high.). the extralite guy's work with FEM, CAD, 3D and other technology to create the best components. for example...he build a spoke in titanium with difference thickness and shapes, he study the torsion and other parameters...

[rush]

line your inner tuber with plastice then fill em with helium. That way youll get a little lift.
And you could talk funny on video


Everyone, please look at this quote and judge this person.

Thank you.

[Povi]

not an AE after all aye rush?

[rush]

No, I still dont quite believe it though.

[tubender]

I could build one stupid-light frame, just for kicks. I think I can build something 1.4 kilo. what dimensions?