Running V brakes on a 4 bolt frame?

[FlatFender]

Is there any sort of adapter that will allow me to run V brakes on an Adamant A1 Frame (4 bolt maggie mounts)?
Please tell me there is. I plan to upgrade to maggies in the future, but im on a budget right now....

Thanks
Luke

[trialsrider50]

yes. heatsink makes one, bonz makes one. some others i think. and both of those brands work very well from what I hear. I don't own those but I've bought others things from both company's and can vouch for their awesomeness.

[FlatFender]

looks like both are sold out....shoot. maybe Ill have to make a trip to home depot and see what I can make myself

[trialsrider50]

if you pick up some 1/2 in aluminum i'll bet you could make one that would work. I don't think it'll be as stiff as the cnc'ed ones from those guys but it could be a temporary fix. your braking will just be a little sloppy

[mhoulmont]

the Zhi adaptors are what i have and they seem pretty nice so far.

http://hbtrials.com/brakes_en.html

[Giant1118]

Is there any sort of adapter that will allow me to run V brakes on an Adamant A1 Frame (4 bolt maggie mounts)?
Please tell me there is. I plan to Downgrade to maggies in the future, but im on a budget right now....

Thanks
Luke

fixed

[FlatFender]

you really think so?
Then why are maggies such a hot item?

[AgrAde]

there's no real advantage. if you get a good magura then it can go 4+ years without any problems, which is the only real good thing about them. people say you can get more power out of them, but really that's just bullshit. main reason for that is that there are a lot more trials specific pads for maguras.

people use them because frames use them, and frames use them because people use them. i've personally never ever felt a magura that i've liked the feel of, whenever i'm riding someone elses bike they piss me off, even when i fiddle with them trying to get them how i want.

get some good adapters, a good booster, some good cable and some nice pads and don't bother with anything else.

[Dekes]

You can bleed maggies with magura blood and have 0 feel to the brake, it's on off, like an electronical switch.

Or you can bleed maggies with water, have a better feel but you will screw the cilinders as there is no more lubrication.

[felix]

The adapters that are available to buy are not the best design. They do the job, but they don't tap the full potential of v-brakes. You loose a lot of leverage with Heatsink/Bonz/Zhi adapters.

If you have access to some tools and don't have two left hands, I suggest making your own apapters.
Here's an example of better adapters: pic (http://www.observedtrials.net/otn3/DSC03479.JPG)

[FlatFender]

The adapters that are available to buy are not the best design. They do the job, but they don't tap the full potential of v-brakes. You loose a lot of leverage with Heatsink/Bonz/Zhi adapters.

If you have access to some tools and don't have two left hands, I suggest making your own apapters.
Here's an example of better adapters: pic (http://www.observedtrials.net/otn3/DSC03479.JPG)


See, that looks like something that would take me less than an hour to make. Do you have any more pics? Im curious if it uses a thread in stud like a regular frame or what?

[toyota200x]

I am also running the same design as Felix. They work very nice. I was running maggies on my Pure and they worked great but I wanted something simpler and less costly to fix. So I went into the machining lab at school and wiped out a pair of adapters.

[beastoftheeast]

The adapters that are available to buy are not the best design. You loose a lot of leverage with Heatsink/Bonz/Zhi adapters.pic (http://www.observedtrials.net/otn3/DSC03479.JPG)

explane.

[Rodmunch]

The off the shelf adapters like Zhi and Heatsink put the v-brake boss lower than the one he showed in his link. This puts the v-brake at a lower position than optimal for good leverage.

Look at the setup in his link and notice how the v-brake boss is in-line with the lower maggie mount hole.

I think that's what he meant. :hs:

[trialsrider50]

^yes but I think everyone is curious if he tapped out the lower hole or what being that vee's run a larger bolt than maguras. that or he used a longer magura sized bolt and used a spacer to fill the space.

and does the adaptor have the holes for the spring?

[felix]

explane.
Explain the loss of leverage or how my adapters work?

This (http://www.observedtrials.net/album/data/500/DSC02947.JPG) is what my brake looked like with the Heatsink adapters. Note that the pads are mounted in the highest possible position. And there vertical clearance between the cable and the tire is also quite limited.
The reason is that the brake mount is moved closer to the center of the wheel. It should ideally be located where the bottom hole of the 4-bolt mounts is.
Exactly that was the idea between my adapters.
One long bolt goes through the brake mount and screws directly into the 4-bolt mounts. By doing that, I can mount the pads much lower (http://www.observedtrials.net/otn3/DSC03479.JPG) in the brake arm. That means they are closer to the pivot and give a better ratio of leverage compared to Heatsink/Bonz...
My adapters don't work with very wide rims though. The brake mount spacing will be the same as the Magura mounts, whereas other adapters offer the possibility to choose from 3 different settings to accomodate all widths of rims.

[Bryan]

Save up for some echo rim brakes. Vs with adapters will give you trouble, like poking holes in your shins when you sidehop.

[FlatFender]

I REALLY REALLY want some more pics of those adapters. If someone could get those for me that would really be schweet

[carnagr]

Save up for some echo rim brakes. Vs with adapters will give you trouble, like poking holes in your shins when you sidehop.

So not true...

[Keith Courage]

sweet. Another Vees Vs Maggie thread.

I say we settle this at the Warrior Shrine A la Mortal Kombat 1.
Vee's can be Raiden and Maggies can be Johnny Cage.

Edit:
http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/2/22/260px-Mortal_Kombat.png
the internet is amazing. I found a picture of Raiden beating ass at the Warrior Shrine.

[jackflash]

so i'm getting a 4 bolt frame (bt raven 7) but still have vees from the old bike and i wanna keep them. I'm planning on keeping them, and making some adapters like felix's. anybody know the distance between the bolts on each stay? and i think its an m5 bolt that i need, but could someone confirm this. and did you guys put any kind of sleeve around the bolt or just have some space between it and the brake caliper?

[toyota200x]

I believe it is 46mm between each hole and it is a M5 bolt.

[beastoftheeast]

felix i understand the clearence issue because my friend has the problem on his mod but the leverage explaination doesn't make sense. if the pads are further from the piviot they are further up the brake arm, longer arm, more leverage?

[psyber_0ptix]

felix i understand the clearence issue because my friend has the problem on his mod but the leverage explaination doesn't make sense. if the pads are further from the piviot they are further up the brake arm, longer arm, more leverage?



the closer the pad is to the pivot, the more leverage and power it will exibit. imagine a door, stick your finger near the knob and close it, kinda hurts. stick your finger near the hinge and close it with slight pressure. you need a new finger


those are some clever adapters made up above. got specs and how to's?

[toyota200x]

I have made a set and used a mill to do it. But as long as you have a drill, correct tap, file, and a hacksaw you could get it done.

[beastoftheeast]

the closer the pad is to the pivot, the more leverage and power it will exibit. imagine a door, stick your finger near the knob and close it, kinda hurts. stick your finger near the hinge and close it with slight pressure. you need a new finger


haha i understand now. i had it backwards in my head. longer arms would give more leverage though? why has no one made some longer arms for trials bikes? flex/strength?

[psyber_0ptix]

i think for the most part, the location of the lower hole on the 4bolt mounts pose an issue for the threaded brake boss for a v brake.

UNLESS you destroy that hole in making a V-adapter, by drilling and tapping it, while yes functionally more powerful, basically leaves the option for the 4bolt system to crap.

i guess mas manufacturers wanted as "easy" a bolt on as posible without modification/destruction of the frame. And having an independant brake boss positioned away from the holes would also require more material or failure would be more likely, making the area around the v-brake boss more bulky. they couldnt position it any higher or in between the 4bolt holes cause the brake pads would never reach the rim and would rub the tire at lowest setting.

i dunno, thats all speculation that i pulled out of my drowsy ass. i have to go get some coffee now


http://hbtrials.com/photos/brakes/heatsink_v_brakes1.jpg

now take for example, if the mass or material was located directly above the bottom 4bolt hole, and a tapped counterbore was used to affix the brake boss on TOP of the bolt that might work better.

picture. OBVIOUSLY THE DIMENSIONS ARE ALL WRONG, just conveying a point of how it could have been designed. i'm lazy, and i just woke up
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v283/psyber_0ptix/untitled-3.jpg


Edit, now that i think of it, this is probably what felix did

[felix]

those are some clever adapters made up above. got specs and how to's?
Some more pictures of my adapters with measurements:
1 (http://www.observedtrials.net/album/data/500/DSC03324.JPG) 2 (http://www.observedtrials.net/album/data/500/DSC03325.JPG) 3 (http://www.observedtrials.net/album/data/500/DSC03326.JPG) 4 (http://www.observedtrials.net/album/data/500/DSC03327.JPG) 5 (http://www.observedtrials.net/album/data/500/DSC03328.JPG) 6 (http://www.observedtrials.net/album/data/500/DSC03329.JPG)
The mount is press fitted to the basis plate. I'm not sure what the adapters weigh. They're made of steel and could definitely be a lot lighter if I wanted.
But I just wanted to see if it works.

The attached pictures show similar adapters. They are machined from one piece though.

[Dekes]

What's the point of the upper part of that machined one in those 3 last pics? the heatsink looks a lot stiffer than that adapter.