noob question about high bb comming from a not soo noob

[mistri@l]

anyways
im in the market for a new rig.
not sure if the low bb and long wheelbase is the way to go
or high bb

the caisso i just rode felt gay
it was 1065 and felt like 1016
so im wondering

those who ride h igh bb whats it like?
does the high the bb make the frame feel shorter???
i just figure a low bb frame would make your standover lower mid centre of the bike.

i like to ride alot of natural
street trials
and urban style of riding

i dont know if it helps
but the only 2 frames i ever felt fine on
were the px tibo
and my monty 219 alp

i cant realy explain myself at all lol.
i hope someone understands what im trying to get at

[Trialsaddict]

those who ride h igh bb whats it like?
does the high the bb make the frame feel shorter???
i just figure a low bb frame would make your standover lower mid centre of the bike.

I have a Czar. I love it. I've ridden many different frames, but I'm liking the new high BB style. I do mostly natty though. It is not good for urban.

It doesn't feel shorter. Just higher. You have to adjust some of your movements and the way you ride. Doesn't take long though.

Everyone will say one is better than the other. Best thing to do is find other riders with different bikes, and test ride.

[Acolyte]

It doesn't feel shorter. Just higher. You have to adjust some of your movements and the way you ride. Doesn't take long though.


You feel somewhat "perched" on the bike while riding on two wheels, at least at first. The ones I've had/ridden feel fine doing most things, they just require some adjusting when you first get one.

[Mat_P]

i havent ridden to many different bikes but i have tried a couple of different high bb bikes (both in stock and mod). and the biggest thing i noticed was that the aorta mod (+60 bb) feels like not much rise at all which i found odd. anyone else notice anything like this?

[KMT]

No one knows what you like or what will you like, the high or normal BB.

Try the high bb frame and you will know if it fits you or not. (Altough it takes months to get used to it fully, and decide if its good or bad for you).

A problem is that there is not many frame on the market with a "middle" geo. I mean about +30-35 mm BB rise. I think that would be a good choice to everyone. It would have all the advantages of high and low bb frames together.

I've been riding a HIFI for half a year, and still dont know if it good or not for me. Taps easier, gaps and hooks too. But my balance (and sidehops) are shit with this.

[Ali C]

I think high bb are the scurge of the oceans!

[lucky13]

^:bowrofl: ARRRRRGGGHHHH!

My take on the High BB = geometry problem with front center measurement of the cockpit. Cockpit = center BB to top dead center Head Tube. Raise the BB, Find a long/tall enough stem to compensate = wierd handling bike.

I ride mine okay, but when it comes to just all out trials I think I should move on to a Low bb rig.

Anyone want to buy an Adamant A2 1065wb, fork (hifi), and stem (30deg rise 130 length)?

[mistri@l]

^:bowrofl: ARRRRRGGGHHHH!

My take on the High BB = geometry problem with front center measurement of the cockpit. Cockpit = center BB to top dead center Head Tube. Raise the BB, Find a long/tall enough stem to compensate = wierd handling bike.

I ride mine okay, but when it comes to just all out trials I think I should move on to a Low bb rig.

Anyone want to buy an Adamant A2 1065wb, fork (hifi), and stem (30deg rise 130 length)?
thats exactly what i was trying to get at
the higher the bb the more wacky the cockpit
i want to feel stable in the cockpit
when i had the px tibo
on rear it was effortless to stay balanced
same with my mod
i geuss im looking for that sort of feel again

i geuss ill go with either a simtra or control
ah ill never make up my mind for a new frame :run:
im realy all over the place
from wantin a simtra or onza to a toxin mod

[xtreme_jeremy]

you should look at the Czar frame! get the short one it rides awsome! I had mine for three days and was hooking up 5 foot plus walls and tapping higher then ever before. even my sidehops were better.

before the Czar frame I was riding a koxx xtp long.

hope this helps
Jeremy VanSchoonhoven

[Stikman]

Or get an 06 Pure. Good middle ground geo, light and short stays for nice control on the back wheel.

My 0.02c

[mikeschiavone]

take a look at the Zhi frames.

[va_tick]

you should look at the Czar frame! get the short one it rides awsome! I had mine for three days and was hooking up 5 foot plus walls and tapping higher then ever before. even my sidehops were better.

before the Czar frame I was riding a koxx xtp long.

hope this helps
Jeremy VanSchoonhoven

Whats the geo on the czar?

[xtreme_jeremy]

go to www.webcyclery.com (http://www.webcyclery.com) click on the czar frame it it should come up with the geo.

it has a really high bb but rides really good! it bunny hops well for a long bike too. I was shocked at how well it rode when I got mine. after the first 20 minutes of riding I was able to up a dumpster to wheels.

It does ballence a little strange most people say its harder to ballence a high bb bike but I dont think so I just think its different so at first it will seem harder.

another misconsption about high bb bikes is that you cant rool down things as steep however with proper training you can go down things even steeper then with something like the Koxx xtp. the reason for this becasue your handlbars are higher. becasue to get the same heithet from bb to handlbars you need to have your bars a 1.5 to 2" higher. we all know that higher bars make it easyer to go down steep stuff and as far as the high bb it does not come into play becasue your butt hits the tire before the extra height of the bb come into play.


The limiting factior for rooling down things is your handlbar hight+wheelbase+tire height. no matter where your feet are your butt can only go down till it hits the tire.


One thing that I think you should know is that the new high bb bikes with short chainstays dont gap as good as the other bike however its not a big difference. also you must learn to lean forward more when gapping to stuff otherwise you will flip over backward after you land becasue its so easy to stay on rear tire.

If there is anything else that you would like to know about this frame just let me know!

Jeremy VanSchoonhoven

[mistri@l]

go to www.webcyclery.com (http://www.webcyclery.com) click on the czar frame it it should come up with the geo.

it has a really high bb but rides really good! it bunny hops well for a long bike too. I was shocked at how well it rode when I got mine. after the first 20 minutes of riding I was able to up a dumpster to wheels.

It does ballence a little strange most people say its harder to ballence a high bb bike but I dont think so I just think its different so at first it will seem harder.

another misconsption about high bb bikes is that you cant rool down things as steep however with proper training you can go down things even steeper then with something like the Koxx xtp. the reason for this becasue your handlbars are higher. becasue to get the same heithet from bb to handlbars you need to have your bars a 1.5 to 2" higher. we all know that higher bars make it easyer to go down steep stuff and as far as the high bb it does not come into play becasue your butt hits the tire before the extra height of the bb come into play.


The limiting factior for rooling down things is your handlbar hight+wheelbase+tire height. no matter where your feet are your butt can only go down till it hits the tire.


One thing that I think you should know is that the new high bb bikes with short chainstays dont gap as good as the other bike however its not a big difference. also you must learn to lean forward more when gapping to stuff otherwise you will flip over backward after you land becasue its so easy to stay on rear tire.

If there is anything else that you would like to know about this frame just let me know!

Jeremy VanSchoonhoven

hm flip over backwards eh? :noes:
well i was considering it the other day actually. it seems pretty stiff
i dont want to run a big goofy mod like stem
id run like try alls or zoo bars.
anywas as for my style
its more like urbany trialsish
i like to bunnyhop
to front tire moves and lots of spin shit
i want to be able to throw down some streety style into my riding
i like flow i get bored of just trials
i like a good mix of the two
like ill be spinging like a nut
but then trying to ride a real tight balance line

what set up are you running on it? as for bars and stem ?
what is the short like 1065? the caisso i just had was 1065 and like i said before it didn feel like 1065 at all it felt way shorter
the czar doesnt have this feel does it???

also i want a frame i can run a 2.6 tire in with the new echo rims
what else here
you know what jeremy id like to see a vid or some pics of you on this thing
mabe thatll help.
i get influenced easily by trials vids :ugh:

[Trialsaddict]

what set up are you running on it? as for bars and stem ?
what is the short like 1065? the caisso i just had was 1065 and like i said before it didn feel like 1065 at all it felt way shorter
the czar doesnt have this feel does it???

I too have the Czar, but the long frame. Can't say anything bad about it. I know the short isn't too much different, but it definately doesn't feel close to the Caisso. I had one of those too. It won't feel good for the style of riding you're thinking of doing. Street style stuff will be more difficult.

also i want a frame i can run a 2.6 tire in with the new echo rims what else here

The Czar will fit a 2.6 tire with the Echo rims. I think I would recommend you checking into the Echo Control instead. I've ridden that too, and I think it would be a much better fit for you.

Good luck.

[carnagr]

I suggest you don't want a trials bike, you want a like Zebdi, or a Base, or even better a Heatsink 24UK.

[mistri@l]

so im geussin either the control or the simtra then for my style of riding
i was looking into the czar because its on sale at hb
i was just tryin to hopefully get away with one of the frames on sale

[carnagr]

I hope you don't mean Simtra St-1. The shit you're talking about is hardcore street trials. Ideally you want a 24, faling that, something along the lines of a Zebdi.

[mistri@l]

I hope you don't mean Simtra St-1. The shit you're talking about is hardcore street trials. Ideally you want a 24, faling that, something along the lines of a Zebdi.

i donno about hardcore lol
i just cant make up my mind
and the time to buy a new rig is gettin closer
i want to get some good riding in before winter

[beedlo]

i havent ridden to many different bikes but i have tried a couple of different high bb bikes (both in stock and mod). and the biggest thing i noticed was that the aorta mod (+60 bb) feels like not much rise at all which i found odd. anyone else notice anything like this?

+60mm is a slightly higher BB than most mods, but very slight. However, its pretty normal for a mod to have > +50mm BB anyways. It sounds big. However, because of the smaller diameter of mod wheels, the distance between the bb and the ground is very similar to a typical low BB stock bike.

I've never ridden a high BB bike, so I cannot comment. Although I would imagine some differences in balance, due to the higher centre of gravity.

[xtreme_jeremy]

from the sound of things the Czar would not be the bike for you.

I am riding it with a Echo stem and zoo bars at least I think that they are zoo.

the high mod stems dont feel good to me on this bike.
the bike does not feel like a short bike so that is good. however for what you are doing I think you need more of an urban street style bike.

Jeremy VanSchoonhoven

[Free-Ride-Junkie]

Mistrial.... you sound like yo uare looking for almost the same thing as I am. The Echo Control has been reccomended several times to me. From what I've heard it has great balance on two wheels but is still pretty easy to get used to on the rear wheel as well. I think I may end up going with that....

[mistri@l]

thanks :Sonic:

well when i was going to order one they were all out
and being as impatient as i am i settled on another frame.
i may order one when the new shipment comes in

also the new echo pure looks realy nice

[KeepRollin]

I don't think anyone has mentioned it, but the reason the Caisso feels so short is because of the 390mm chainstays. The 1065 Control feels much longer since it has 375 stays and that extra half inch really makes a noticeable difference (I have a 1065 Control and have ridden a Caisso)

[mistri@l]

I don't think anyone has mentioned it, but the reason the Caisso feels so short is because of the 390mm chainstays. The 1065 Control feels much longer since it has 375 stays and that extra half inch really makes a noticeable difference (I have a 1065 Control and have ridden a Caisso)

also because it was designed for a french smurf

[RyanMcVicker]

im 6'3" and i think the high bb is more cramped feeling, id rather have a bike with slight bb rise probobly... right now im still on my pure 1080 with 0 rise...