Echo Control Setup

[AaronLutze]

I just ordered an Echo Control and I need some help figuring out which bar/stem combo is going to work best. I am running an older Planet X Ti fork on the bike (I don't know the length but it was from Europe about two years ago so I'm thinking it's probably 400mm). What bar/stem combo (or length/rise) would you recommend for that bike?

Here are two pics of the fork (on the bike)...maybe this will help determine the length?
http://www.matchvideozine.com/bios/aarongap.gif
http://www.matchvideozine.com/bios/fakiewall.gif

I'm mostly going to be riding natural stuff on this bike (JJ and I are both getting back into trials and there is some choice natural riding around here..)

Also (I know this sounds weird) but what kind of rear cog should I run with a 26t front chainring to get the right ratio for natural? I am dead-set on running this 26t in the front, so any suggestions for the rear cog would be great.

Thanks in advance!! I will post pics when I have the bike dialed in.

p.s. Does anyone kick off the Magura crossover lines anymore or did the newer geometries fix that problem? Just wondering if I should run a steel line or not.

[trialsrider50]

Smallest cog I would run on the rear would be a 20 tooth. Of course I would go to ffw and run an 18 front, 12 fixed rear. Do a 20 or 22 tooth depending on your preference, in this case I would run 20 cause I like to have a little extra room but most guys like that instant power feel a smaller ratio gives you. 26 in front and 20 rear would be my suggestion.

Stainless steel crossover lines. cheap and easy. plus no more leaking WHEN you kick it. it'll happen eventually.

As for stem, I ride mostly mod so I really wouldn't be able to help you out. but theres enough guys on here to fill in that blank. maybe you should tell them how tall you are, that would make a difference.

make sure to post some pics when you're all done so we can see it.

-Good Luck

[AaronLutze]

I'm hovering between 5'11" and 6'...I ordered the "long" version of the Control, I don't know if that makes a difference for the stem or not.

Thanks for the advice, I'll go dig up some 20t rear cogs!

[Trialsaddict]

Went with the Control.... Dece

[dingus]

I have a 26t on my zebdi, a 23 or 22 will suit you much better than 20. 26:20 is equivalent to a 22:17. 26:22 is like a 20:17, which is between 22:19 and 22:18.

I say 105-110 X 15degree and low rise, tryall type bars. And then leave 3/8 inch room on the steerer for fine tuning.

[will4eva7k]

Smallest cog I would run on the rear would be a 20 tooth. Of course I would go to ffw and run an 18 front, 12 fixed rear. Do a 20 or 22 tooth depending on your preference, in this case I would run 20 cause I like to have a little extra room but most guys like that instant power feel a smaller ratio gives you. 26 in front and 20 rear would be my suggestion.

Stainless steel crossover lines. cheap and easy. plus no more leaking WHEN you kick it. it'll happen eventually.

As for stem, I ride mostly mod so I really wouldn't be able to help you out. but theres enough guys on here to fill in that blank. maybe you should tell them how tall you are, that would make a difference.

make sure to post some pics when you're all done so we can see it.

-Good Luck
18 front, 12 rear... thats damn heavy

u gotta be nuts to run that a heavy ratio

that sounds like a gear ratio you would use on a mod, not a stock

and so is every other gear ratio he mentioned, they are heavy as anything

18/15 or 18/16 would be around right ..or 26/23 or 26/22.. or 22/19

[Peace]

i doubt a 26tooth would fit on a control, they have pretty wide yokes.... I run 22-18 and love natty, havent run anything else...

Peace

[WhiteRavenKS]

trials revival? doule you tee eff?!

funny thing is i bet lots of "modern" folk get their asses kicked by these "old schoolers" in no time.

anyways, like dingus said- try a 90-105mm stem with 10-15 deg of rise on that control i would think. im really happy with my 105x15 stem but im shorter and on a shorter bike. seems to be a good balance of weight on the front end and clearence for other moves like wheel switches and such.

and a 22t cog in the back would work great. 20 is going to be a hard gear to push for natural. i think surly makes some nice ones in that size. and i havent kicked a cross over. ever. probably will now that ive said that... oh wait, vee's- score. but yeah, ive crashed in some weird ways and hit my ankles all over the brakes and never once kicked the cross over. a booster helps that a ton. any threshold or similar booster will make it really tricky to actually hit your line.

[Cryo-Cube]

dont listen to trialsrider50 (member.php?u=4573)
26-20 is way too hard for natural
go at least 26-21, 26-22 would be the best imo

[AndyT]

aaron- run the steel magura or just a booster...kicking lines will never go away :)

[lucky13]

26/21,.. the 21's are more common right? 23,21,19,17.... etc cassettes,.. careful with the carrier ones though,.. I've stripped the 19t right off of a Durrace carrier.

Stem? hmm,. try em all out,.. depending on the top tube,. you said long right,.. well? I'm about the same height and all,.. I'd start short at 70mm or 90mm and move it out at 10mm increments,.. granted I'd find a bunch of cheap stems to start with then buy a nice version of the feel good length.

Serriously, Props Aaron. You inspired me back in the day with the red and white schwinn you used to rock at college. Talking with Jeff (j-lo) about the oldskool scene you guys were movin made me wonder when you would get back at it, though I know you had a lot goin' on, bikes not a priority vs married life and all.

Drop by if you're in the area eh? Do you still have the ol' Diamondback demo stuff?

Joel

[BrettM]

I gotta recommend a 110 mm x 15 degree rise stem and a mtb bar. I'm assuming you are keeping the Black Market to ride the other stuff on. I would definately keep the bars the same style at least if I could. I have a bike for each and it is much easier going back and forth now that they both have the same handlebar on. Be careful with some of the trials companies that make what look to be mtb bars. They feel nothing like it.

I don't know how big that 26 tooth cog is, but with a lot of these new bikes a 22 tooth is pushing it. You might get forced to run smaller. If it does fit it sounds like you are gonna wanna run something in the 21 for a hard gear to 23 for an easier gear in the back.

[trialsrider50]

You all need to go work out and get some leg power goin!! just kiddin, that's why I said "in this case I would run 20 cause I like to have a little extra room but most guys like that instant power feel a smaller ratio gives you." I like some room to play but go with a 22.

[MegamoMidwest]

holy crap aaron, you are getting back into trials? maybe the Chicago scene will live once again! hmmmmm

[werkinit]

old skool !!!!!!
right on have a talk with lenowsky !!!!!

[AaronLutze]

Err...no luck for the Chicago scene...I live in Pennsylvania right now (about 45 minutes from JJ Gregorowicz). Either way, I'm psyched to get this new bike going. I rode with John (Trialsaddict) last weekend and got re-psyched on riding trials again, especially with the "new" geometry. Everything is so easy on these bikes!!

Lenosky still rides trials...just not on the competitive level like he did. He can still kill it though. We're going to do a demo together in a couple weeks at some Jeep Festival or something like that. Hopefully I'll have my new ride up and running by then.

So can anyone confirm or deny the compatibility of a 26t ring on the Echo Control frame?

THANKS!!

[AndyT]

it will probably work with a 240mm bottom bracket.

[werkinit]

think that means yer fookt

[AaronLutze]

Crap...I had a set of Deity cranks and a 26t custom e.13 bashring I wanted to use.

What setup would you guys recommend for cranks/chainrings?

[PunkVaulter]

Yo aaron I remember seeing you ride at the warped tour in asbury park way back in 99 or something like that. Where's this jeep demo you and jeff are riding at? I'd come check that out!!

[AaronLutze]

The Jeep demo is in Jack Frost, PA the weekend of August 13-14, but it's "Camp Jeep" so I guess you have to be a Jeep owner to come to the shows or something like that. I'm out of the loop on this one, but I do know that Lenosky is going to have a big dirt jump jam on the 23rd of August in his backyard if you want to see J-Lo in action.

[rtorrenga]

If you are interested in using a bmx style 3-piece crank like the Diety Cranks, threshold makes a bashring for 3-piece if the spindle size is the same as a Profile Racing crank. I run a 22T ring and a 19T rear cog with Profile racing cranks.


http://www.observedtrials.net/album/data/506/4370Older_Echo-med.jpg (http://www.observedtrials.net/album/showphoto.php?photo=3245&size=big&sort=2&cat=506)

[Noel]

Drop those tanks you call cranks, and get a pair of Middleburn or Bonz cranks. Go staight up trials.

[AndyT]

Yo aaron I remember seeing you ride at the warped tour in asbury park way back in 99 or something like that. Where's this jeep demo you and jeff are riding at? I'd come check that out!!

holy shit moristown nj..where i grew up....i'll be there in a few months, who are YOU! :)

[AaronLutze]

Morristown is a sick-ass place to ride, we filmed there with Reed Merschat back in the day...let me know when you're coming through and I'll make it over for a ride, too.

[hopsalot]

My friend is running a brisa bar and stem, big rise on the stem but feels just right with the high bottom bracket. Also its my experience that around 30 inches of gearing will feel kinda nice. See you at Rays MTB, bring that new shiny trials bike with you next time you hit C-town.

[PunkVaulter]

holy shit moristown nj..where i grew up....i'll be there in a few months, who are YOU! :)
Yes sir morristown is where I ride a lot. I love it there. I'm actually from long valley, which is about 15 miles away. Oh yea, my name's andrew, and I've been riding trials part time for about 3 years due to college sports, but I'm now riding full time!! I'm totally down for some riding whenever you guys are in town. If you don't mind me tagging along :Wavey: And I'd love to see Jeff ride in his back yard! That'd be awesome!

[hello?]

i would say that it wouldnt fit. ive got a bt and im running a 22 tooth up front and it just clears the stays. thats the problem id be worrying about here. or your going to ahve to get a huge bb.

[dkoppric]

get an echo stem (like 110) and the zoo riser bar. that is what i am running, but i have a 1080 pure. they are made with the idea of running an echo stem and echo flat bar, but if you are used to bars that aren't below your knees when you ride the riser is the only way to go. or if you have a roox bar and stem lying around they feel good on it too, just dont let someone talk you into getting a try-all bar, they feel really akward.

[AndyT]

Yes sir morristown is where I ride a lot. I love it there. I'm actually from long valley, which is about 15 miles away. Oh yea, my name's andrew, and I've been riding trials part time for about 3 years due to college sports, but I'm now riding full time!! I'm totally down for some riding whenever you guys are in town. If you don't mind me tagging along :Wavey: And I'd love to see Jeff ride in his back yard! That'd be awesome!
what college were you at...

[WhiteRavenKS]

just dont let someone talk you into getting a zoo bar, they feel really akward.
different strokes. different folks.

[dingus]

that shits bananas

[AaronLutze]

Dang, I was hoping that all of my old parts would swap over but now it's looking like I need a new crankset and bar/stem. What do you guys recommend for a crankset?

The only advantage that I really have going here is that pretty much any setup with this "new" geometry is going to feel awkward to me coming from an old school background, so I might as well do it up the "proper" way right off the bat.

[Elan]

what kind of gearing do yo uwant? if you want a super small uci bash, or Front FreeWheel set up, middle burns or Tensiles are the best, Try-all and zoo also have decent ones also. the only "regular" mtb crank ive used is hte raceface NS LP compact drive, i dont think they make that any more... bonz makes the best 'standard' 4 bolt cranks for trials though.

if youre wanting to go the 'new proper' direction, i recommend a tensile/zoo/try-all crankset with a track cog, youre probably using a king now and thats great.

[PunkVaulter]

I was at lock haven university in central pa...... I was a pole vaulter..... Look me up "andy pollison" on google..... I was really into the pole vault, so I had to put trials on the back burner, but now I'm all about trials.....I ride in mo-town a lot and am always looking for people to ride with......


what college were you at...

[Elan]

II was a pole Look me up "andy pollison" on google..... I was really into the pole .
:momaru:

[PunkVaulter]

Oh yea, and AndyT, that avatar you've got freaks me out!!!!! But you've got a good name "andy" haha.....

[PunkVaulter]

haha you got me on that one..... But keep in mind.....I took my LONG pole and put it into the BOX!!! at the end of the runway


:momaru:

[Elan]

i think andrews parents own morristown.

[PunkVaulter]

which andrew? sure as hell aren't mine.....haha.....

[Elan]

toncray

[PunkVaulter]

ahhh true true.......that'd be cool if they did.....then we could ride the whole town without getting arrested!!!!!!


toncray

[AndyT]

rofl yeah right elan, if you only knew....nj has real ballers, its east coast money there is no money here in colorado. First off we have no connections to any organized family so we couldn't own shit.

[Elan]

jews :greddy:

[AndyT]

italians.

[AgrAde]

italians.

don't be hatin'

[lucky13]

Dang, I was hoping that all of my old parts would swap over but now it's looking like I need a new crankset and bar/stem. What do you guys recommend for a crankset?

The only advantage that I really have going here is that pretty much any setup with this "new" geometry is going to feel awkward to me coming from an old school background, so I might as well do it up the "proper" way right off the bat.
I'd run Bonz, Tensile, or BT cranks and some company combo for bar/stem i.e. zoo, echo, tryall, BT or just go old school and mix up some thomson/easton or planet x/ raceface,.. whatever. It's going to depend on how you like your wrists and lateral control. Some dig the flat Try-alls, some don't. Some dig mtb rise and sweep, some don't.

I thought you were a rock star,.. just buy whatever eh? :momaru:

[AaronLutze]

Awesome...thanks for all the help guys, I think this bike should be pretty dialed once I get everything rolling. The frame is coming in two more weeks so I will post pics and everything once I get it dialed. Thankfully I do have a King rear wheel sitting around and that Ti fork should be pretty dope, too. Other than that, it sounds like I'm going to have to replace everything else!

[dankilling]

Aaron- where are you at? I met JJ in Bloom (in-laws live there) at the skate park, and just spent some time with Jeff at JT MBW. Im in the Allentown area and would love to hook up. I suck at trials but am OK at street and DJ, but just got a Brisa together to work on trials.

[AaronLutze]

I live in Millheim, which is about 45 mins from JJ....right outside of State College (and about 5 minutes from Woodward). Drop me an e-mail: aaron@matchvideozine.com and we can definitely hook up for some riding.

[PunkVaulter]

Oh damn I just moved back to jersey from state college. Fun place. I'll hit you up next time I visit people out there....


I live in Millheim, which is about 45 mins from JJ....right outside of State College (and about 5 minutes from Woodward). Drop me an e-mail: aaron@matchvideozine.com and we can definitely hook up for some riding.

[AaronLutze]

Yeah, if anyone is ever in the area, let me know and we'll ride. State College is good from what I've seen so far, plus there is dope stuff in my area.